Laravel Cloud Office Hours

Hi everyone. Welcome. Sorry, I'm changing my camera. Welcome to Larville Cloud office hours. We should be live. So, yeah. Hi everyone. Okay, we're good then. I'm back to Streamyard. Um, for this stream, I was using Riverside Wednesday, which we might kind of go back and forth, but back to Streamyard. Um, happy Friday, everyone. Feel free to share where you're checking in from in chat as people are getting in. Um, we're going to be doing Laravel Cloud office hours today. I'll wait a couple minutes, two or three minutes for people to get in though. Uh, while we do, how are you doing, Devin? I'm doing well. It's been uh two weeks since Laru. I think I finally recovered my sleep schedule. So, that's nice. I've messed my back up because I was just telling Don. So I live in Colorado. I'm in Florida right now. It's not a huge time difference, but it's like a different time zone. Um, so I went from EU Amsterdam, which was like 8 8 hours, I think, ahead of where I live. And then I went back home and I was there for like a week or so and kind of readjusted. And now I'm in Florida, a different time zone. Then I'll be going back home next week. And then like a week or two from that, I'll be going to San Diego in California. So, my poor sleep schedule is never going to know what's going on. Yeah. Yeah. What What even is sleep at that point? Yeah. I'm I'm glad my next travel is just down. I'm going to Georgia next week for the Atlanta meetup. So, Mhm. Oh, yeah. Same time zone. You're great. Doortodoor flight is like two and a half hours, too. Direct. Can't wait. That's gonna be so easy. Yeah. I think that's how my San Diego one is. It's like two and a half. Um it's pretty short from Colorado, which I guess makes sense. But those are always nice. Yep. Although those short flights sometimes you end up on like a twin prop airplane that has to burn off fuel to manage weight on the runway and you're like, do I really trust this? I've never had that happen. And now that you might jinx me now. No, I don't I don't think from Denver to San Diego you're going to have that. But from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania to Connecticut, that happened to me. Oh, yeah. Little puddle jumper. And I was like, "This is crazy." Yeah. I got on a flight one time from I think it was Pittsburgh to Connecticut or the other way. Might have been Connecticut to Pittsburgh. I had to walk out on the tarmac, like not through a jet bridge, out on the tarmac, up a ramp into the plane, like instead of a regular jet bridge, and then uh they literally they they got on the runway and they're like, "All right, we need to rearrange for weight distribution." And I was like, "What did I sign up for?" Something I've seen recently, I think this is out of Chicago, so like the O'Hare airport, is like some of the flights, I think it's through American Airlines, it's like, "Okay, here's your flight. you go to like get on your flight. It's a It's a bus. It's an American Airlines bus, which I can't say I would like that. That would throw me off. But hi everyone. Um we wait a few minutes so let's go ahead and get into it. As people are like joining chat and joining us, make sure to say where you're joining from. Um and happy Friday everyone. So today we are here to do Laravel cloud office hours or just for you to hang out with us. But um we'll be answering some questions about cloud. Any questions you guys might have um we can briefly talk about some things that launched this suite too cuz as always it's excite an exciting week here at Laraveville. Yeah, Devin's got an excellent t-shirt. We have a pizza shirt today. It's pizza and basketball capital of the world Yukon. Oh, okay. That it's that t-shirt. I feel like we had a like spirited Slack discussion about that t-shirt. I love this shirt. Shout out Dave Hicking for getting me this t-shirt. So yeah, what's up Dave? Happy Friday. But yeah, um so let's just jump into some quick intros, I guess. My name is Leah Thompson. I'm a Devril engineer at Laravel. I work closely with our online communities um in hosting live streams like this one today. and I'm here with Devin Garbalosa today who's been doing the cloud office hours with me. But if this is the first one you're catching, then this is Devin. Devin, you want to do a quick little intro? Yeah, absolutely. Devon Garbalosa, solutions engineer at Laravel. I work with customers who are looking to migrate onto Laravel cloud. uh a lot of times mostly Laravel private cloud and when they have bespoke requirements and different setups and things I help troubleshoot how that can work on cloud and where we can kind of move their apps forward so they can stop doing DevOps headaches. We love that. We love stopping DevOps headaches. It's the best. Yeah. Give give us your DevOps Yeah. Yeah. Please give them to us. Especially because I'm not on the cloud team. So you're not even giving them to me. I'm so good. But yeah, so if you don't even know what Laravel cloud is, then this is the right place to be too. Laravel cloud is a fully managed place to host your Laravel applications. And if you have any questions about cloud or any specifics, this is the place to drop those questions. Um, we do have a slido that is linked in our YouTube description and I think description for all the streams, but I will also also share it. So, I'm going to share the admin link for slide and not the guest one. This should be it. This should be it. So, if you join or if you go to the slido, you can drop questions in there. You can also just drop them in live chat. And yeah, so the purpose of office hours is just for you to ask any questions about cloud. Um if you have specific migration issues um or migration questions you can ask them here. If you have questions about different things on cloud like preview environments um we released new stuff on cloud this week. I think it was GitHub SSO login and we also changed the seats um for cloud. But with the seats all we changed is that you have unlimited seats now right? We just got rid of seats basically. Yeah. Yep. So, no more no more extra for seats. Yep. Yep. For you and your agents. Good one. Hi, Florian. Hey, Flo. Happy. I was going to say another big one this week. Laravel 13 dropped. I know. Yeah, I was trying to hit the cloud ones, but Laravel 13 dropped, which is a huge obviously huge uh launch for Laravel. So, very exciting. Um, and then I know Pushpack worked on the what, like the boost prompt. Um, the boost update for updating from Laravel 12 to Laravel 13. So, I know a lot of people were talking about using that like on Twitter and I think even in the inertia stream on time is so fake. It was on Wednesday. People were saying they used that and it worked beautifully. So, that was a big thing this week. We also had Forge manage databases that launched this week. What else? Feel like I'm missing stuff. Yeah, stuff launches like every day around here. It's awesome going on. I know Inertia V3 comes out next week, I believe. So, that's in beta right now. That's pretty fun. Um, that's uh I actually just upgraded a project for an internal tool to Laravel 13 and Inertia V3 beta. and uh works great. Welcome in. Go pal webdev. How are you? Happy Friday. It is so hard to keep up. Florian, um Pascal was saying too, Devon, that there is a like when you were upgrading, did you said you you upgraded to inertia v3, right? Did you use the boost command for that? Did you use boost upgrade? I did forcibly. I didn't mean to. And then it was like, "And I also upgraded you to V3." And I was like, "Thanks. Let's go." Then another big thing. How'd you know? I like to live on the bleeding edge. I love this. Well, our website, the Laravel homepage is now React and Inertia, but it's Inertia V3 already. Yes. Chip um ported that over. It was fully ported over, I think, as of t Well, technically Wednesday at 4 a.m. Nice. 4 a.m. ET. Yeah. So, we're on B3. I love Chip. Yeah, he's great. He was He was cooking on that. But yeah, so much exciting stuff. Let me see. I don't know if there's any questions in in I almost said in cloud in Slido. If anyone has cloud questions in chat, feel free to drop them below. or honestly any general questions too. You got us for the hour. So you have questions about Laravel or anything, feel free to throw them at us, ask away and we will uh if we don't know, we'll just tell Florian to figure it out. So yeah, works great. We have a strategy. Mhm. Also, I may not know everything, but I know where to find it. We are streaming now. Um, not only on YouTube, not only on YouTube, Leonen, and Twitter, but we also have a Twitch account now. As of yesterday, we have a lovely Twitch account, uh, twitch.tv/aravelphp. Nice brand spanking new Twitch account. I was so excited about the Twitch account. Hi Roxy, how are you doing? Happy Friday. Which Roxy will be starting a new job soon. Oh, congrats. Has not announced, but yeah, everyone in chat, please say congrats to Roxy who signed a an offer. So, I'll be starting a new job coming up. First job in tech was able to quit um working in education. Sounds like a familiar story. I know. Just like me. Oh man, that was so exciting once I was able to start my first job in tech. But like it's like back in my day cuz that was like four years ago this year, which feels wild. It's graduated high school. What? Yeah. No, it is. Yeah. I'm so glad that joke went over your head. I was like, what? And I was like, oh, okay. Hi, Nibd. Welcome in. How are you doing? Um, I don't know what that question is. See a question from uh D Hickcking up there. Take a stab at that one real quick. Oh, okay. That's a good one. Why should somebody be excited about Inertia V3? Because Inertia V3 is awesome. Point blank. Um, now to be more serious, uh, a lot of nicities coming to Inertia V3. So, one thing is if you use Inertia today, uh, you have two separate entry points for serverside rendering versus client side rendering. And so for a lot of people, they either remove that server side rendering, never added in the first place, or run into a lot of different problems trying to get serverside rendering to work. And so, um, especially pre-cloud days, getting serverside rendering to work meant you had to make sure node was installed on the servers and things and whatnot. With cloud now, it's just a click of a button. We can show that here in a moment. Um, but what inertia v3 has done is it's collapsed that into a single entry point. So your app.ts tsx file if you're if you're using uh React, which is my main front-end language. So, I make a lot of React references. Uh you enter through that one place and it will figure out how to use that and it will gracefully fall back from SSR if it fails. And so, you have one runner for it. The plugin does a lot of the stuff for the build pack for you natively. And so, it really just makes SSR kind of native by default, which is really great. And I've been throwing out acronyms like crazy here. So, why SSR? Why serverside rendering? Well, the main reason that people like to use server side rendering is SEO. You want your website to be recognized. Client side SPA are really bad at giving the metadata about themselves. So, server side rendering allows you to improve that because it sends back full HTML from the server to the front end and then allows that to hydrate and then repopulate. So, that is another great reason to use that. So, that's one major reason. I know I just talked a lot there. Leah, anything on on that piece you want to interject with since you're you did the marketing stuff. You understand SEO way better than me, internal tool guy. I think before there wasn't really a way to do local SSR either, right? To like test it and now there is. There was an artisan command on the Laravel one that you could run to do SSR, but if something broke, it just crashed and then you'd have to go fix it and then restart it and then So, yeah, now it's a little more graceful. And I think um I know because I just did a stream on Wednesday with Pascal on Inertia 2. So anyone who's interested in learning more about Inertia V3, I would say go look at that. Um go look at that video. One second. I'm trying to find the recording from the live stream because I did it with Pascal who worked on Inertia V3 and he did like a deep dive of all, not even all because there's so many new things like baked into V3, but he focused on like the heavy hitters of Inertia V3 and he did like a solid 50 minutes of demos on that. So, it was like a deep dive into them, but it's also um a way to like return errors um like better error handling of knowing if something's wrong with your like SSR server. So, like knowing if that crashes. I know for me a big thing um which here is that link for the YouTube video to go watch the recording from the live stream with Pascal that I did on Wednesday of this week. Um a big thing for V3 is optimistic updates. That's something I'm very excited about and I think other people are excited about because for me being able to get like the instant um response like at least on the front side, you know, it's not you're not actually getting a response from the server, but it looks like you get an instant response because you can click a like button and it would instantly update to show that because it's optimistically updating as if that uh request to the server is going to be accepted and nothing's going to go wrong. And so it feels really snappy. You know, I'm someone where like if I clicked a button and it didn't update right away, then I'd probably spam it and then by the time it does update and goes through the server, then it's like changing again and then I'm getting mad at it. And having optimistic updates is just really nice. Um, it also has like instant roll back for if it fails and you don't have to do anything there. It's already set up. There's also the HTTP. I was going to get into that next. Yeah. Yeah. That's something that like people are really excited about too. And to me, I really like it because we have use HTTP hook now, which the syntax for that is like the use form uh helper that we have in inertia. So it feels like or it doesn't even feel like it is the same syntax. So you're not having to switch to like Axios um which if you wanted a standalone HTTP request, you would have to write that in Axios before now or fetch, but Axio makes it way easier and Axios is a big big file to include in your build. Mhm. So, takes that down a ton. Yeah. Now, we no longer have that. I think another side effect of that too is if you're using Inertia for most of your app, but then you have some API endpoints where you want to have some reactivity on the page and you didn't want to lean on Inertia to do it. um and you were going to make that HTTP call like an SPA would, you would have to insert sanctum um in there and then you use the SPA off flow to validate the CSRF token. And so a lot of times you'd create like a bootstrap JS file, you'd set up Axios globally to always have that so you have the XSRF token built in for the authentication to pass through Sanctum. The use HTTP hook has that already built into it. So you don't have to introduce that Bootstrap and Axios and all that. You can just use the use HTTP and it's securely making those requests knowing who the user is. So that was another big win for me because that was always my first thing. I brand new app Laravel nude got it open then I'm like all right how do I make these API calls work? And every single time I'd have to go back to the docs because I never remember because you set it up once and then it works right and so it was like how do I set this up again? Oh yeah, there it is. Perfect. So that was a big win too on that one. Um, I shared my screen if you want to pull it up. I was going to show how you could set SSR in uh in layer above. Thank you. I didn't even notice it. My bad. Look at that. So, if you are using serverside rendering, you could come down with inertia specifically, you can come down here and the way that you enable it is you just check that box right there. The only other thing that you would have to update just so that we're sure what's happening there is in your build, you need to make sure you are building your SSR assets. That's important as well. So, you got to make sure you're doing that. That's it. That's as easy as it is. Sorry, I'm I'm trying to change to something else. He's like, you're talking. I'm like clicking all these windows. Yeah, you just click the assets. So, now that Leah is not being a distraction in your deployment settings, make sure you're building your SSR assets as well as your regular assets. And then just use SSR built in right there. You're like trying to talk. All of a sudden, I move it. You're off the screen. I was like, "Did the window sharing look different than it normally does." So, I was trying to change the different layouts. I'm sorry. Yeah, no worries. We called this out earlier, but it's actually only 9:00 a.m. for Leah in her brain, even though it's 11:00 a.m. where she actually is. So, we'll give her a pass. I also got three hours of sleep, so my brain It's It's trying. It's trying its hardest cuz whenever it's like 11 o'clock here, it feels like it's 9:00 because at home it is. So then I'm not tired. So then I go to sleep at like 5:00 a.m. here or 3:00 a.m. cuz I already stay up too late at home most of most of the time. So what you're saying is when you're in this time zone, you're an optimistic update to your life. Perfect. Love it. Yeah. I actually going back to inertia v3 optimistic updates uh are amazing. So essentially if you know where you're going to go and say you're on an index page of data and you're going to go to the show page for that, you can click a button or set in your code to optimistically render that page ahead of time with the data passed to it. So it'll fill that in and then only the skeletons of what you had a recall go and so the instant click comes in. And as Joe Tannen Bomb said in his talks that I've listened to, this is this is a sharp sharp knife and be careful with it and this is not the answer for everything. He's going to hate me. I veently disagree and I'm going to use it everywhere religiously and make cause problems for everyone. So it is one of the coolest things. Oh yeah. Optimistic routing is going to be everywhere. Sorry, not sorry. That's an amazing feature. I know one that they said like not to like to be careful with um and proceed with caution is like the instant visits because some Oh, that that's what I meant is the instant visits you like not the optimist updates. Yes, because I was like um I was thinking about that. Pascal said instant visits actually got like people are way more excited about it than they like saw too. Oh, it's it's amazing. Yeah, that's that's what I was talking about. So, I I said the wrong thing. the instant visits not the optimistic updates is where you could basically say hey I am going to load this component and here are the props that I already have from this component to that component. So before you send the HTTP request to the back end to load the next page render on the front end pass the data and then you can have your skeletons load for the other props that aren't part of that that you already have and then load it and yeah it's it's a sharp sharp knife that I'm going to cut everything with. I am so excited. I imagine like the cat emoji of holding the knife. Yeah. That will be me with that. I love that. You're right, Roxy. We should We should just always win. It's like good night and good morning at all times. Um and then we have a great cloud question here. What types of applications is Laravel Cloud best suited for? Laravel and Symphony right now. Um, that's the the trope I'm going to give, but I can I can dive into that a little more. Um, we have a lot of different applications on Laravel Cloud, um, that do a lot of different things. We see a lot of e-commerce websites doing exceptionally well. Um, especially applications that have kind of cyclical life cycles. Um, so your Monday through Friday apps, you get heavy traffic during business hours, but overnight kind of goes using the hibernation and some of the autoscaling helps those to save a ton of money because you can meet the needs um on the on hours and on the off hours kind of let it rest a little bit. Um, so ecom's a big one that we see um, we see a lot of stuff for like chat applications and things that run pretty well, especially with with the way that the autoscaling can do that. um the marketing sites. I mean, marketing sites do great on it, especially um one really cool thing for cloud, this isn't on all plans, um but we offer preview environments and for marketing sites, especially if you're working with like an agency to create some marketing sites for your company, having those preview environments that will spin up as soon as a um like PR is open across uh for Laravel, it's like when a PR is opened up against the dev branch in or like dev or the main branch in our marketing sites. It will trigger a um preview environment to be spun up. So then it will respond in the GitHub PR thread with a comment that has the link to then go um like you click the link, it spins up a URL. You can see how that like how the PR will look right on the site as if it was live. So you're just like seeing it in this preview environment, which is really helpful for when you're working across teams or like I said with an agency. You don't have to like dive into the code necessarily to see how it's going to look or like spin it up locally on your computer. You can just go to that that link for the preview environment. Yeah, those preview environments are literally once you figure out how to make your dev cycle work with preview environments, you will never go back. They are so good all over the place. I don't know how we lived without them. Yeah. Well, dev servers, staging servers, paying deaf, devops people. Yeah, I mean I remember how we lived without them. I help people every day get on cloud to not use it anymore. So I mean we get it. Crazy. But yeah, man, they're beautiful. They're really helpful. Najib, to really answer your question, the types of applications that Laravel cloud is best suited for is as cheesy as it sounds. Laravel applications. It's designed for basically anything that the framework has out of the box plus all the ecosystem to work really well. So if you're running something on Laravel, um Laravel cloud should work really great for it. Um the only time that we see kind of apps struggle to work with Laravel cloud are the ones where they started with Laravel and then they uh they went a little rogue on the the way they wrote PHP around Laravel afterwards. So awesome. Yeah, I will say environments. Go ahead. Yeah. Oh, I was gonna say um I will say too that um we're working on making like cloud easier to start with too cuz that makes me think like for side projects and stuff. We're making it easier to like get started on cloud and like host your first project especially like side projects. We just rolled out last week um the new like free trial for cloud which I realized that after I was like what's new in cloud? That was last week but we haven't had an office hour since then. That's right. So yeah, if you go to cloud.larbell.com now you could sign up and you can get a free trial right away. No credit card required. Uh $5 credit for you. You can give it a give it a whirl and get a real app on there. So check it out. And then and asked, "Is there a demo or trial for Laravel Cloud?" And Leah didn't even read that before she answered that question. Look at that mind mind readader. But yes, we have a um let me see. We have a free tier, a free trial now for Laravel Cloud. Whenever you sign up as a new user on Laravel Cloud, you get a free $5 credit. And if you're thinking to yourself, okay, but like that's $5. It's only going to last like 5 minutes. Like, how am I actually going to be able to host my application with only a $5 credit? Uh Josh on our Devril team released a great video showcasing how long $5 last cloud because it lasts way longer than you would think, especially if you're using hibernation and like enabling different settings on cloud. Um, so let me share that link in chat and that was just released this week as well that video. So this video is a really great resource to use whenever you are trying to utilize the free trial on cloud and get um kind of as much use out of that $5 credit as you can. And then there's also documentation that's linked in that video. Let me link that. And what were we going to say, Devon? I was going to say the the thing about that $5 is if you are looking to do a big test on a big app that needs to serve a lot of traffic $5 probably not going to get you that far which is honest. Uh if you are looking to do something like a side project or something and you can take advantage of hibernation and the databases and sleep and all that then I mean you could I think we've seen people run apps for $5 a month that hibernate most of the time for side projects. So, it's very possible to get quite quite quite far on uh discovery with that. So, check out that video. It was really good. And then I also linked the docs um because we also have it in the documentation of how far $5 goes and then the different things to enable. It's funny cuz I was talking to Josh and I was like, "Oh, this app like cost $4 to host this month." And he's like, "Did you have hibernation turned on?" I didn't. And there's like a little disclaimer that was like, "Hey, if you don't have hibernation turned on, if this like um server is up the whole time, then the compute will cost like about $5." Yep. So read read people, I say as someone who wasn't reading and I was like this cost $5. Um we also have a beautiful usage page which that was that like last week too. So now it's easier to tell. Let me pull that up. See, after we've been live a little bit, the juices are flowing in my brain. I started thinking the juices flow. This is our test account. So, this is this is not real money, but real app. So, got a bunch of stuff here. So, the new usage page, you just click on usage here and it'll pop up for you. So, you can look at the different periods. Oh, we backloaded some periods in here, too. So, that's awesome. So, you can kind of see your bandwidth, data transfer, how much of your crude allowance. Uh, you could set up alerts if you want to know like, hey, I need to know before we hit $10, you can go ahead and save that and you could set up the alerts for that. And then here you have your resources built out. So resources are talking about your databases, your caches, your buckets, your websockets, the different things that you can use on either a singular application or environment, or you could use it on multiples. And so this kind of gives you the ability to see broken down by those different features what you have out there. And then it gives you the total summarized cost. If you don't really care about the details, you can uh you could just look at the top here. But then you have your total resource cost down here. So again, this is not your applications and your compute. This is just all the peripherals that kind of go around that. Hold on. I'm gonna No, it's still the same. It's switching me. The screen's just different than it usually is. Sorry, that was star. No worries. I won't change it again. All right. So, then you get down here and you can see kind of your total application spend and then your cost for the um for the application. So, if you have multiple environments under an application, you'll see what the total cost is versus what the the actual um singular cost is. So, you can kind of click through your different apps. You can kind of see what's happening through some of these. And then you could see like how many CPU hours were used, how many replicas were in there, how many hours they were up for, all of that. And then if you have any other add-ons or things, they kind of show up there. So, this just gives a way more detailed look. Um, this updates hourly, so you can kind of see it as the month goes on through the current period. So, you uh you don't have to go wait for an invoice to kind of see a detailed accounting of where you're at. So, and this is on the um man is the environment level, right? Yeah. So, you can change of course I don't I use preview environments so I don't think I have any secondary environments on applications out here but yeah that's I said it wrong too. I meant organization level like if you are in an actual application you won't see this. You have to go into organization and then to usage. Yeah. that click in. Yep, that's exactly correct. So, this is a org level org level setting. Nothing at the application level for this because it's I mean it is used have to be in the usage dashboard. So, yeah, this was new launched last week really great uh by the team. The other thing that updated is we heard feedback about this used to be three levels deep. So, you'd have your org, your app, your environment. And a lot of people were like, "Yeah, but I don't most of my apps are single environment so I don't necessarily need that." that. And so this new chooser here allows you to kind of pick through that. And so as you do that, you'll see I had to keep this one purple because I used blue for all of them, but then I was like, "Oh, let me make one purple." So you could actually see there's a difference because I am a super predictable person. I always use whatever GitHub gives me and I have one environment per app. So yeah, I'm usually the same way or at least on my own apps, I'm the same way. It's not like that on like any of the Laravel sites. Yeah. Another interesting thing is the GitHub integration was set up a little differently now too. So you can actually choose the repository and it links that through there. Um, and you can now connect a GitHub or to multiple GitHub I'm sorry, a GitHub or to multiple cloud orgs. So if you've got like your personal projects and your work projects, they all kind of go off each other. You can connect those to multiple accounts instead of having to have it on just the one now. So that's another big win there. Um, and then I mean while I'm in here, let me see if I could find some logs on this. There is now filtering for static dates on the logs. I didn't know that. Yeah, brand new. So, you could pick the time and date. It's just for the last uh whatever the retention is, which is seven days. And so, now you can really start to hone in on logs and things. And you could choose whether or not to refresh it so it doesn't auto refresh on you so that you're jumping around. So this was a a big update that was made uh last week as well. So apparently last week was the week to week to have updates. I think Google SSO might have been last week too. It was recentish. So we had Google SSO last week or so and then GitHub SSO was this week. Yeah. So now if you log in, you can log in with Google or GitHub here and it'll tell you last use. So you could like remember when you get here. So it'll just take you through that flow now. So I'm going to stop sharing before I open my one password to log back in. Yeah, smart. Um, and Najib has said, "I love how Laravel's docs are super clear and easy to follow." We love hearing that. Um, Laravel's docs are pretty fantastic. It was something I like loved whenever I was getting into Laravel. I loved how clear the docs were. But some docs are just like sparse. Some are just way more sparse and so it's harder to like find out different information. Yeah. I love when you look at docs for something and you're like and I need AI to summarize this for me. Thanks. Remember when you didn't have that ability like two years ago and you had and then you're like what what is this thing saying to me? And then you had to like copy different things and it's like explain this please. Yep. Yeah. That was a big one. Yeah. No, the docs are super clean. I love that too. Uh that's actually just Taylor. Taylor cares immensely about documentation. So that just ripple ripples through not only the company but the community too. So and then Samuel had asked um also hi Samuel how are you doing? Ask an insider behind the scenes from your experience when when would choose my SQL versus Postgress on Laravel cloud and vice versa. So when would someone choose my SQL versus Postgress for an application that doesn't have features specific to either engines? It's very interesting. You really you really crippled me with the feature specific to the either engines there because that's actually where I go most of the time with this question. Um Laravel MySQL is a great option. Um it is available in all regions and it runs in our Kubernetes cluster which is a great great way to get your latency down. Um our Postgress runs through a partner called Neon. They do not share all the same regions that we have. So I think that there are three regions Canada, Ireland and UAE that we have that they don't support currently. Uh so your only option is Laravel MySQL. So if you're in one of those three regions, you get my SQL. Um unless you're on private cloud and private cloud, we do have some business class databases through RDS and plan scale coming soon that um helps us to close that gap for for other customers. Um but those databases are powerhouses comparatively. there's there's not a a cheaper version of them. So that's why they're on private cloud. Uh also it deploys them differently. Um so it helps to get them inside the VPC for latency and for data residency and isolation reasons. So that's that. Um I'm really spitballing here because I'm thinking through this. How would you pick this one? Uh I I end up I'm a Postgress guy personally. I'm just going to call that one out straight up front. I love Postgress. I've been using it a lot um for probably the last six years um and I think that it works really well. So I usually reach for Postgress first. Um if I think about the different apps that I'm working on and things whenever I'm reaching for Postgress now oftentimes I'm using something where I'm trying to do AI tooling through an application for users for the normies as we call them and um with that PG vectors built in basically native to almost every Postgress database and so being able to get those embeddings from an LLM and store them in a database natively Postgress is just a very clear winner there right I know my SQL 9 I believe is building that in. Um so that will probably close that gap a little bit for my SQL but if you're not doing stuff AI oriented you don't care about vectorization and things um I think my SQL does help to be a little more forgiving to database design than Postgress does. So I'd say it really depends on the app specific features which one you choose. But yeah, that's it's kind of that if that didn't answer your question, Samuel, feel free to ask a clarifier here and I' I'd be happy to dive back into that. But if you ask me, I'm a Postgress guy. So also for me, especially for side projects, I normally go with Postgress because um we offer hibernation on the Postgress ones currently. Yeah, that's Yes. So the Postgress ones to be on hibernate. Yeah, you could sleep those. So that does give you that ability. Um, but the the total all-in monthly cost of running Postgress monthly versus my SQL monthly on cloud, I think the lowest my SQL is $5 a month, does not have hibernation. The lowest Postgress is $20 a month, but does have hibernation. So, you can get that lower. So, uh, depends on what you're doing in the app. But yeah, um, we have some other questions. I want to real quick say, happy Friday, Dan. How are you doing? Um, he said, "I love the new change." Yes, Dan. Dan Johnson and loves the new change that says command F inside the environment variables box. Thank you. That one if if you did not see the tweet chain on that one. One of our private cloud customers, uh, Diagonal hit us up in Slack and was like, "Guys, I really wish that I could control F to find this." and Jason begs on the team like not even four hours later was just like hey go refresh just shipped it. So that was uh that was a huge win that we love getting that feedback. So if you if you ever see something in cloud and you're like man I really wish you could do this please open a support ticket with a feedback request and send that in if it's something that a bunch of us have also ran into and we're like actually yeah we should probably just do that now that people are asking for it like we can make those things happen quick. Where is it? Where's what? I guess like I mean I could demo it if you'd like. Yeah. No. Do I? Hold on. Let me before you share. Before you share, let me go make sure there's not like secrets. I won't share. That's That's the problem is there's like secrets in there. I got to make them up. All right. This one This one's fine. I could share this one. Let me pull this. Actually, your screen's been live the whole time. I'm just Yes. Wouldn't surprise me. You would never show up on office hours like Leah, please. Okay, there we go. So, right there, just command F and then you could search for what you're looking for. Oh my gosh, that's so nice. And with some additional features for reax and case sensitive and things there. So, that one helps a ton. That is so nice. I know. Um Josh was showing me yesterday, I think yesterday, that you can I think command K when you're trying to I think is for whenever you're going to add a new application, you can command Where is it? It was somewhere. He was saying you could command K or something and I did not know that. Or command something. You mean the uh the command pallet? Maybe. Pull it back up. Yeah. So, if you're on cloud, you can command K and you have the command pallet available to you. I think that's it. Yeah, I didn't know So, you can jump around to different things here. Yeah, that's another huge benefit if you don't see that. Now, if you didn't see that one, just for what it's worth, it tells you right there. Again, reading reading's hard. Reading's hard. I'm from Florida. Okay. They don't teach us how to read correctly. That's other people from Florida like education for writing code. That's a joke. That's a joke. Um, and then Chris Harding had said earlier, I'm running Tailscale on cloud with a few tricks so it can connect to a typent server for scout. Is there likely to be a more official way to do this in the future? Hope you don't mind. Thanks. Yeah, we don't mind that question at all. No. Uh I also Florian hit this in the chat, but yes, please please reach out to me um about that and I will get you connected with Florian. Uh you could probably guess my email. It's my name.com. I would love to know how you're doing that so that we can look into what's going on with that because we we use Tailscale for a bunch of stuff. Um, and so this is probably just one of those hacks we haven't tried a hack yet because we haven't had a need, but we'd hear this come up uh quite a bit. I wouldn't say very often, but like maybe once a month somebody asked me this question. So, I think this would be a really good one for us to consider. And I know uh I can already tell by Florian's answer that he's interested. awesome. I want to pop to the one, right? Oh, can we go back to the Yeah, I want to dive into that one. There's one that says, did I hear correctly earlier that seats? Yes, they are no longer a thing. Unlimited seats for everyone. Everyone gets a chair. Go for it. Organizations don't have that. I just want to hit that one quick because it was fast. Yeah. So, Apache and Engine X, we can jump back to that one from Najib if you want. One second. I was going to pin to the LinkedIn user too um the tweet from yesterday about the seats just to show it's official but yeah no seat limit on Laravel cloud all accounts now have access to unlimited seats like Devon said and now we shall jump back to Apache versus EngineX. Yes, Apache versus EngineX. Uh in my opinion there is one answer to this question and that is EngineX. Apache was the web server of the 2000s and EngineX is the uh the web server of the 2020s in my opinion. Well, 2020s and beyond. Um they're both good. They both do their thing. Engine X has a lot more nicities built in for modern developers that I think um you also have the ability for applications that don't that are not very specific to one stack. You have like EngineX Union available where you can kind of run workloads directly off that. So, um, I just think EngineX is putting in more work than Apache is on the servers. And so, I would I would choose EngineX. Um, if you look across the Laravel docs for deploying to production, we provide documentation for how to set up EngineX or recommendation on where to start. Um, and what we use on Laravel Cloud and Laravel Forge is EngineX. So, question. Um, here's a I guess maybe you'll be able to answer this one. If Cloudflare locked you out of your own IPs for three hours, what stops AWS or GitHub from doing the same to another layer tomorrow? I mean, valid question somewhat. It's a little bit different than Cloudflare locked us out of our own IPs for three hours. uh Cloudflare unfortunately created a bug by using whatever method that they did and that started deleting records from a database um essentially I won't say it's an actual database because I don't know how Cloudflare was set up uh but they they basically caused an issue for about a quarter of their customers that use a very specific service called BYO IP or bring your own IP. um there was a way for about half of that quarter that was set up to reinstate their IPs themselves through the app because they were still like in the data set. They just weren't published correctly. Um and I'm using the wrong word there. I always forget it. Florine, if you can tell me the right one. I think it's advertised is the right word. Um, so there was no way for us to self-reddiate that um during that outage because we unluckily were the short straw of the users that were most recently affected from from their outage. Um, and it took them a while to get back to restoration on that. So, um, from that perspective, 100% yeah, that was that that that sucked to put it plainly. Not a fun time. out of that what we've started to look through is how do we have redundancy in the system for when that happens and how do we plug and play those in in different areas and make sure that there isn't a single point of failure in the hot path and so that's something the team is working aggressively to patch um you know AWS and GitHub I mean is it possible that they also go down I mean let let's be real GitHub has you know one nine's reliability right now happens a lot um so there's ways around that you you can you can get through that. They're not they're not necessarily in the hot path like some of the other ones would be here. Um, yeah, BGP advertisement or BGP announcement is what the Yeah, announcement advertisement. Okay, I've been using the right words. I just always feel like icky when I say that and I'm like, I don't know if that's the right word. So, yeah. Um, so so so fair. I think AWS is probably better than GitHub. Um, AWS doesn't have a reason to really lock anyone out or or mess something up like that. Now if there is an outage that is affected I mean right now our entire uh me central one region is down because of the issues the conflict in the region the AWS data center in the UAE is destroyed and so we have a region that we can't deploy on right now and so that's that's a real concern but those those things happen and we're trying to respond in what's best for our customers on those situations and redundancy and single point of failure is just not something we want to stay in the business of and so we're working aggressively for that. So, um I appreciate the question and keep asking it. Um you know, the accountability is important on these, but I think that the the Cloudflare issue was very unique and it was very unfortunate that we were in the small portion of companies that did that. Um the other thing I'll highlight on that is Laravel Cloud's operational plane was down. Most customer workloads were still reachable underneath and there was no data loss attributed to it. So if the application was reachable, you were still able to continue to use your app and things. Deployments were stopped um because you couldn't reach our control plane, but uh it did not affect as many of our customer workloads as as it did our own application. And so I think that's another big thing to point out there. So yeah, more to come on that. We're definitely committed to making that a better process and and getting that working. Then Rahan had a question. How can I make Laravel handle um I'm guessing that's supposed to be DDS DDS attacks. Yeah, DOS attack or huge traffic like how would you say the end? Ye ye that's that's a old if I'm if I'm not if I'm not mistaken I'm gonna have to call on some of the OGs in the chat like Dave or um Florian that's a old PHP frameworky um I mean Laravel cloud handles quite some load and I did a pressure test for a customer's application um back in February that we're working on publishing some more stats on. I was able to sustain 17,000 requests per second with a jittered backoff for the response times for over an hour twice. Um, so it's definitely you could handle a ton of load and a DOS. I mean, in fact, Cloudflare flagged it as a DOS attack and we had to put in a white list to let it bypass because it looked like DOS and so was getting caught. So, um you can make um you you can make Laravel applications run huge traffic, huge huge traffic. And we have we have quite quite a few uh customers that run some some interesting workloads that handle 15500 2,000 requests per second on private cloud. No problem. Don't even sweat. Lorian said Laravel is probably as old. Yeah. No, I know that. But is Ye hasn't had an update in a while, I don't think. And is it PHP? Like that's the part I was I was confused about. I've never even like I never even heard of Ye until I started working at Laravel and then people were like, "Oh yeah, I got this Y thing I'm rewriting." And I was like, "Hold on. Hold hold hold the phone." What? I feel really bad. Someone said, "I think the same person typed ye in chat earlier and I thought it was a typo. I had no clue what they meant. So I didn't read it and now I'm realizing it's a framework. So I'm so sorry. That is my bad. I did not know what it was. Yeph PHP. That's an interesting one. It probably did get an update. I'm probably being I'm probably being a little ridiculous, but the website's a little old. Yeah, could but Laravel can definitely handle it. The framework can handle it. Laravel cloud can definitely handle it. It uh it often times sneak preview on some of the stuff that Florian and I have been working on. uh it's usually your database, your schema design, and your interactions with that and not using caching and not using some of the other nicities that are built in that cause you to have uh bottlenecks. It's usually not PHP. Awesome. Um boots on the ground journalism here. While we've been live, this is a little sidetracked from what we were just talking about, but while we were live, a new inertia v3 beta was released. Um, Pascal tweeted about it. It adds support for VIT 8 and simplifies the layout props feature. So, the use layout props hook has been removed and layout props are now passed to the layout component as regular props. So, please upgrade and then share your feedback on that um the new beta with us with the team. I linked Pascal's tweet here. Let me link that GitHub repository for Inertia um specifically Inertia V3 as well.js because if you um notice any issues with Inertia especially specifically Inertia V3 you can open up issues on that GitHub repository or open up PRs there. Let me share this. This is um for the specific 3.x branch. So there is that link in chat there. Uh there is a question in our slido too by the way. Oh is there? Great. Yeah. Um so the question slido is hey any chance you can add the option to purchase additional custom domains? Currently the only option to get more than three is to upgrade the business. Thanks. That's a good question. I thought growth was five. Let me not that not that that's what you're asking, but I believe I believe you can do up to five on growth. Um, but yes, there is a way if you if you are in cloud. Let me let me share my screen. I will show you how to how to do this. All right. you are in cloud and you need more domains and you're on the growth plan. You can go here. You can click this help button. You could ask a question and you could say I need more domains. Put how many you need, 100, 10, five, however many extra domains you need and we could set that up. Um, if my memory serves me correctly, they are 50 cents per domain per month to add extra domains over the top. So you can add as many as you'd like there. Um if you have a lot that you want like talking hundreds thousands then our support team can get you in touch with our sales organization who may be able to do some bulk discounting on that. So do you know if we have any documentation of that of do I know if we have any documentation? I don't but I will go check. Okay. Because if not that'd be nice to add I think yes know how to add agree with that. That was a really good question. Thank you so much for whoever asked that question. Um and then Chris said, "Loving Inertia V3 so far." I love to hear that. I Every time I see the demos of it, I get really excited. Um I still have not upgraded my project yet. I mean, I'm in Florida, so a little hard to work on side projects right now when visiting uh with family and stuff, but I do plan on upgrading all my side projects to Laravel 13 and Inertia V3. And I'm going to use done all of them yet? No, I haven't done all of them yet. Come on. How dare you? I know. I know. I'm slacking. How dare I? I DM'd you a thing to throw in the chat. There is indeed a limitation section in the domains docs that says if you have a special use case for many domains, contact us to raise your limits, which I think that sends you to our our contact form. But yeah. Nope. Nope. Send it to our support. Yep. This is being Do you know which one it where it says what you said on it? What do you mean? So I'm linking this or I guess hold on let me open that has that also shows the limits the one for starters. I see exactly what you're talking about now. Some for some reason I opened it in a different tab and it took me slightly further down the page. But if you go to cloud.lair.com/doccks larvl.com/doccks/domains pound or otothorp hashtag which whatever you want to call that limitations it will take you to the specific section uh Devon was talking about in our documentation talking about domain limitations uh which says like Devon said if you have a special use case for attaching many domains to contact support to raise your limits We love documentation. Love it. Love it. And the search feature at the top of our docs is pretty good, too. You could search search domains and things. And I did read the command K there for some reason. In cloud, I did not RTFD, right? Read the docs. We'll let you fill in the blank on the app for yourself. Well, we do have a hard stop at exactly an hour today. So, we'll be ending the office hours at exactly 12:00 p.m. Eastern time, which is it should be what? 4. Yeah, it will be 400 p.m. UTC or if I was normally normal Leah in Colorado, it would be what? 10:00 a.m. 10:00 a.m. for me. But basically, we'll be ending office hours in four minutes. So, if anyone has questions, uh, last minute questions, feel free to throw them into chat. But we'll go ahead and kind of start wrapping up. Yeah, there's one more question that came in if you don't mind. Where? DXNT DX enter. just tuned in. Yeah. Yeah, just saw that. Okay. Uh, might need to rewind, but has there been any updates on the Q visibility functionality that we discussed in the past? Uh there has been some updates internally on this that are going very well. We've gotten some uh some real headway made on that, but we did not talk about it yet on cloud office hours because it is not ready for prime time for uh users yet, but we have been working a ton on this in the background. Uh this is definitely something that comes up a lot and so something we're working on. So stay tuned when it drops. We will make sure you hear about it here. Maybe not here first, but here for sure. Yeah, it'd be fun if it was first, but it would be, but I don't think we're faster than some of those Twitter fingers are. So, I don't think so either. As soon as things are like someone's posting it. Yeah, I could tell you for this feature too, Taylor is probably going to be the first person out the foxhole screaming about it because he's he has a vested interest in this one. So, but yeah, awesome. Should be good. Um, and like Florian had said, because I think this is about what Chris responded to Florian. Yeah. Um, it's totally fine to do stuff different ways. We're just interested in seeing how users are using the platform to see how we can make users lives easier, things we could possibly like implement or use for cloud like to make it easier to integrate that with cloud. Just Yeah, for sure. Like that. Thanks for sharing those details, Chris. I really appreciate that. I'm going to try and replicate that myself later. So, if anything, for science, it's really helpful for science. Awesome. But yeah, if anyone has any more questions, um, we're wrapping up here now, but feel free to throw them in the slido, which should still be open, and I'll copy those over to our slido for the next office hours, which is not next Friday, but the following one. I think it's April 3rd, possibly. which sounds fake because I feel like March just started, but I think it's April 3rd will be our next Laravel Cloud office hours when me and Devon. It'll be the same time. It's every other Friday that we have these. I hate the fact that you just called it out, but you're right. It's like March 3rd today. How is it April 3rd in two weeks? This is ridiculous. I know. I know. I was looking at that. I was like, April 3rd? There's no way. And it's like, my god, it's the 20th. Like, we were just in Amsterdam. I was just just turned March. Speaking of, if you are in Atlanta or the Georgia area, next Thursday we have a meetup. Uh you should come check it out and we will a bunch of the team will be down there. Uh it's our first Laravel Road Show. So come on, check us out. I will be there. Come say hi. Um and I will make sure that we get a link real quick over to Leah. Yeah. Yeah. I was googling it. Yeah. Yeah. So if you haven't, go ahead, sign up. We'd love to have you come hang out with the team. Uh, we have Joe Tannon doing a talk. We have uh Braden doing a talk from Omega Software Staler from Titan doing a talk. So, it'll be a great time. Good vibes. And, you know, I mean, I'll be there. So, if the other three names don't get you there, I mean, I'm pretty cool. I think sometimes I'm sure there'll be some merch. Probably Devon has a whole bag of stickers, so there'll be stickers for you. There'll be hats. Um, I'm guessing because he pointed at it. If not, blame Devon, not me. There will be there will be okay. Yeah, I got I got all the stickers. Come find me to get stickers. Yeah. So, definitely RSVP register to be there. And then I'll doing a stream with Josh next Wednesday as well talking about his Instruct package he built and how he used Laravel AI SDK and different things to build that. So, yeah, hope to see you next week in a stream. If not, see you at next cloud office hours. And thank you all for being here. Thank you, Florian. Hope you all have a good Friday and bye.